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Furher talk about "tieban shen shu" 再談《 鐵版神數》


As per the response from my earlier article, I would like to take the opportunity to write a bit more about the 鐵版神數 which seem interesting to everone here.
Another popular great old TCM master 朱雲山. In his book 《鐵版神數心得》, ( the book i have, can see from the photo), preface said:
序 preface
<鐵版神數> is like a heaven book of no words, regardless of a person has been mastering those i-ching, zi wei dou shu and others for long years, if without the guidance, advise and learning from the <鐵版神數> specialist master (sifu) , the person would still be unable to break into the core of <鐵版神數> for accurate operation, still like being an outsider, no matter been several ten years studies into it.
鐵版神數,就像一本無字天書,凡未蒙熟精此道者點竅、說明,欲自個兒閉戶造車,即使已有易卜、斗數等詣境,心血熬盡了,數十年歲月過去了,卻仍是一介門外漢! 
The attractive of it, apart from the phrases are written in classical poem style, it has the power on telling a person's family details such as parent born/death year, parent remarried/ divorce, number of brother sister, number of children, the person married remarried how many times, brothers and/or children capabilty, the person's death year, etc... So accurate that like had been closely living with the person. If this is being used properly, you could be able to make use of it for achieving.alot of things, showing off your magical power to people in everywhere. It might look simple in its methods, which relate to the yi xue eight trigrams where the Heavenly stems are being mapped to specific trigram (bua), Earthly branches are being mapped to specific trigram, daymaster is mapped to specific trigram, using Ho Lo (River map, Lo shu) methods to derive the relevant numbers....... selection and mapping of those trigrams, then converting the trigrams into numbers. These numbers could be brought down to lowest level coding for details. Ever said two persons of aame bazi might have different destiny, this is due to the birth time different, for the reason 鐵版神數 method has further divided one bazi hour (時辰) into 8 sections, and further into each section for which 15 minute slot, once the birth time at such details is set correct, then using the abacus to calculate as per the various relevant fotmula for computing a set of numbers giving to the person (client) to search as per the numbers in the destiny description book for relevant details.
鐵版神數引人入勝處,詞藻優美是的特色,尤能道出人之六親、運命、生死諸事,歷歷如繪,用之得法如虎添翼,足以炫世,究其八卦加則天干配卦、地支配卦、日主配卦、河洛配數、地支取數……無非循此配卦,再以卦取數世。此數甚精微,嘗謂八字同,而命有異者,乃時刻不同,故以一時推八刻,一刻又推十五分,時刻準確則命數悉合,至此在算盤上撥弄加減算出幾千幾百幾十幾,此數可授書由客人去翻閱。
The charming of 鐵版神數 since the ancient time to nowadays, has been increasing the popularity and reputation, especially among those high official people, politician, weath upper class people, entertainment movie and tv stars. Those wish to own the 鐵版神數 secret operating method, should not be too stuborn on taking the written formula poem wording meaning, as the proper way should be following your feel and sense at the time of the process. As a hint here, if you use 邵子 methods for deriving the numbers, you would be easily lost in the maze. Like a gold lock but noone could open it. 鐵板神數 has its own silver key, these.are kind of secret methods(eg encoding, decoding, etc) , once you know and own it,.you are powerful in everywhere.
鐵版神數魅力無窮,自古及今,盛譽益顯,達官貴人,影視紅星皆趨之若騖,希望擁有這套心法者,祈勿被詞意所困,如看無字天書,悟是非最佳途徑,神來之數隨意而發,從此通暢無阻矣!心得感言鐵版神數若用邵子數來求,卡在迷魂陣中,似一把金鎖,從無人能開啟。鐵板神數另有一把銀鑰,也祇有些微「心法」而已,有了它,夠您行遍天下。
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In the search of one old TCM master (Zi Wei Yeung紫徵楊) who is famous in zi wei dou shu 紫微斗數, it has one live example of the destiny findings for a person once his/her birth hour into specific hour section and minute slot been set correctly.
3809 此刻生人,雙親俱全。born at this moment, you have dad and mother still alive living.
8689 分有前母,生我後母。 your dad has two wives, so you have two mothers, the second one gave birth of you.
6929 兄弟五人,同父不同母。you have five brothers, from same father but different mother
9767 妻命甲子生,姻緣注定。your wife was born in 甲子 year, your marriage is destinated.
8661 先女後男,數定不差。you have a daughter then follow with son.
5331 數有六子,四子送老。you have 6 sons, by the time you pass away, you have 4 sons making the funeral arrangement
7205 子多而貴,樂莫大焉。you have many sons, all are very capable having big achievement.
4534 慷慨熱心腸,為人無鄙吝。you are ver generous and passionate helping others, a righteous person.
7251 問名無成,問利有益 you dont have reputation achievements, but have achievements in business, money wealth.
3584 數注其人,四方為家。you are destinated for having a travelling life, everywhere can live and work
3035 經商異地,满載而歸。you in overseas are doing very successful business, make yourself very rich.
In his rseach, he saud, due to different school/lineage and also different master's specific coding methods for confidentiality, the birth hour section and minute slot of a person derived from Master A may be different from Master B.
Futhermore, the numbering methods used for each destiny description note can be different among those.masters.
各派大師再用密碼法不同而編號的批文也有所不同:
Below are three very famous and respectable TCM masters ( 吳師青, 馬翰如, 阮閒雲 ) also the 鐵版神數 high skilled masters in long old days though all had passed away at long time ago. Though the same number is used but for different destiny description, so mean each of them having their own coding and decoding.method.
For example,
Number: 90470 - Destiny description
(吳師青) 夫小五年 hubby is 5 years younger
(馬翰如) 母親何日逝,金水是歸期。mother pass away in year of metal or water.
(阮閒雲) 數有倫枯,妻帶微病。wife's health is often suffering from. small illness
..............................
From all these, you could imagine how mysterous is this TCM method, in order to keep its prime position in the TCM society circle, rumour has it, the master is alowed to teach and pass on this secretly to only one disciple ( some said, is within 5), never would be openly teaching in class.

My first "tieban shen shu" destiny telling book 我的首本《 鐵版神數》書籍


Since early 80th, those days in Hong Kong and Taiwan tranditional chinese metaphysics sector circles as well as the entertainmemt sector circles (eg. Movie stars, tv stars, singers) have been very hot about going for 《 鐵版神數 tieban shen shu,》for destiny telling. The English translation would be "iron plate oracle destiny telling". Out of my curiority, I bought in my first book which was written by the famous TCM old master Leung xiang run 梁湘潤 (1930-2013) in Taiwan, so as to understand more about thus TCM fortune telling method as well as why it is so attractive.
八十年代初, 在港台命理界和娛樂界均盛行著《 鐵版神數》批命。因好奇之下, 也買了本 台灣沙門梁湘潤先生 所編著的《 鐵版神數》來查討下何謂 《 鐵版神數》又有何吸引力。
This book was published in Hong Kong by the 麒麟出版社 publisher and printing company. This book consists of 241 pages, at that time was selling at HKD 20 ( = euro 2.27 approx now but at the value of 30-40 years ago) I believe, this book is the first edition due to the date of the aurther's preface is Republic of China calendar 64th year 10th month, converted to western calendar would be 1975.
這本是 香港的麒麟出版社所印發, 全書共二百四十一頁。當時售價港幣二十元。我想這是初版, 依作者序文日期是中華民國六十四年十月, 即西曆一九七五年, 也是我首本 《 鐵版神數》書籍吧。 
As per the preface, there are various versions of 《 鐵版神數》available and being used for the fortune tellung, especially the destiny description notes used are vary among each other. Nowadays those commonly used ones are the versions written in ancient china ching dynasty time. In general, there are 3 main stream versions commonly used:
序文有説及,《 鐵版神數》在坊間有好幾種不同之版本, 尤其是「 數序 」所附之吉凶合註文, 甚有大之差別, 目前所能是到之版本, 皆屬” 清代 ”之作品, 最流行之版本, 一共有三種: 
1) 南派 數序有一萬二千條  "nan pai" (pai = school/lineage) has 12,000 pre-numbered destiny description notes
2) 江南派 數序有五千條 "jiangnan pai" has 5,000 pre-numbered destiny description notes.
3) 中州派 數序有一千二百條 "chung chou pai" has 1,200 pre-numbered destiny description notes
Nowadays the "nan pai" school/lineage version seems to be the majority, using 12,000 pre-numbered destiny description notes. 《 鐵版神數》Is regarded as the most complicated destiny telling method.as it has included various TCM methods and formula (周易河洛數序, 卦爻策數, 五行干支, 紫微斗數, 子平法, 七政四餘。。。。) as parts of its computation.
目前所見者為南派者居多, 即是一萬二千條註文之吉凶條文。 《 鐵版神數》為命理學中最為淵博之一部巨著, 其中包賅之範圍, 自漢代之三統曆以迄至清代之時憲曆。 取材包含 ” 周易河洛數序, 卦爻策數, 五行干支, 紫微斗數, 子平法, 七政四餘。。。。 ” 等等。 
This book has explained what are those TCM theories, methods and formula being used in the 《 鐵版神數》, with explanations about their basis and fundamental information. It has taken me several times repeatingly reading slowly about the book content for understanding, due to the contents involved some TCM methods I havw not studied or have limited knowledge about. The purpose and content of this book are not to guide.the readers on how to operate and to use it, but is to give a proper and comprehensive introductive view of information about the 《 鐵版神數, prior to the next steps for further studies. Due to this book, subsequently I bought in few relevant reference books for studies.
這本書也介紹了各種被《 鐵版神數》所涉及的術數其基本法則, 本人資質低庸, 實不容易即看了便全明白, 要翻看多次又再參巧其它所涉及的術數專門書籍作輔導。然而, 這書隻可作為對《 鐵版神數》有一個正確全面性的初步認識, 並非能帶你走入如何起數後至運算出條文序號。 因緣購入這書閱讀, 也引致後來買進其它相關書籍作研究學習。 
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《鐵版神數》is said to be first invented in ancient china song dynasty by the famous TCM master 邵雍. The mysteriousness and interesring of this fortune telling is, it can also tell very accurate about a person's family members in details, such as the chinese animal zodiac of the father, mother, brother(s) and sister(s), wife and children, whether have step parents, number of brothers and sisters and children, number of wife or hubby from re-marriage, whereas other TCM fortune telling methods could NOT achieve at such lowest level of details and also accurately. In bazi method, it follows to use the ancient clock timing way, ie 24 hours are mapped into 12 earthly branch time slots, whereas the 《 鐵版神數》even further decompose each EB time slots to 8 sections 一時辰有八刻 for its calculation through various complicate sets of formula extracted from different TCM methods.
The format of the above-mentioned "prenumbered destiny description notes" is similar to those listed in the 《河洛理數 he luo li shu 》. See below photos attached.
By now, I know very little about this mysterous destiny telling method so don't know how to use it, but surely it is always good as having something interesting for continuously exploring from time to time.

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Joseph Luk

Other reference books

Joseph Luk

Examples of the《 鐵版神數》version of 12,000 prenumbering destiny description notes,






Joseph Luk





Examples of the 《河洛理數 he luo li shu》.prenumbered destiny description notes

马翰如:易元会运


学习铁板神数必看的经典「易元會運」為香港的馬翰如先生所作,成書於1959年,跟據一代易學大儒邵康節先生的「皇極經世」推演出來。

邵子秉承子房卦變 之術,以一元十二會,一會三十運,一運十二世,一世三十年,起掛於夏禹受命後的第一甲子,即西元前2217年,易推中土治亂興衰 之像,上下縱橫十二萬九千六百年,至西元1583年癸亥止,實一部曠世奇書﹗邵子將歷代的治亂興衰演敘至宋熙寧之需卦止。清人西 昌劉斯組斗田氏續敘,從宋元豐至明朝終朝止。馬翰如先生的「易元會運」則細敘清朝黃太極建元事起,即西元1624年值卦大過初爻 至西元1963年值卦巽之六四爻止。

從西元1964年值卦巽卦之九五爻至1983年值卦巽卦之上九爻,馬翰如先生做了一個大概的 預測。 



马翰如作家所着易元会运再版序 


八十八岁葵叟老人撰周易一经,经伏羲、文王、周公、孔子四圣所阐扬示范。秦汉晋唐以来及宋元明清诸名儒,对易经之探研解释,见仁见智,美不胜收。岭东棉阳马君翰如,聪颖勤奋,研读经史,深悟易经始末之奥妙,并以邵康节皇极经世之通灵,证明周易演变之神秘,令人豁然贯通,了解百世旋转之预言,匪易才也。

观其所编者「中国原子哲学」一书。(民国三十五年出版)。早已获得广东省教育厅奖许,暨海外舆论界好评。再于民国四十八年己亥之秋,编着「易元会运」。细观其经世值卦之变化,正是由公元一六二四年甲子起。(清太祖朝,甲子年。)历大过卦,即由前清太祖建元天命,传位皇太极太宗,又经世祖顺治,再历鼎卦、干卦、遯卦、讼卦之圣祖康熙、世宗雍正、高宗干隆,仁宗嘉庆、宣宗道光、文宗咸丰、光宗同治、德宗光绪、废帝宣统、中华民国。以至巽卦一九八三年第二癸亥止。--(民国元年第一壬子。民国六十一年第二壬子。民国七十一年第二壬戌。民国七十二年第二癸亥)统计前后上中下元三百六十年期中,国家发生变动情形,可为纲鉴。枚举当年各值的卦爻,所主吉凶休咎之系辞,核与史迹无差,足为考往察来之资料,抑亦二十余年前所预言之事件,于今发现之荦荦奇迹,莫不若合符节,堪叹观止矣。子曰:「君子居其室,出其言善,则千里之外应之,况其迩者乎!居其室,出其言不善,则千里之外违之。况其迩者乎!言出乎身,加乎民,行发乎迩,见乎远,言行乃君子之枢机,枢机之发,荣辱之主也,言行,君子之所以动天地也,可不慎乎!」此即易所以险为易之义,亦即易所以易险为夷之精微欤!子曰:「易其至矣乎」?「夫易所以崇德而广业也」。坤卦文言云:「积善之家,必有余庆,积不善之家,必有余殃」。方今世界震动,变化万端。尤其核子危难,惨绝人间。更不胜浩叹。读此易运,则周易百世预言之秘即白,我侪自应提高警觉,亟须反省潜修,好德乐善,庶可享小康大同之福焉,尚矣。易元会运之探研,莫非阐扬哲学,启发人世,其匡导之功大矣哉!翰如作家承海内外学者之吹扬,特将此书再版行世,索序于余,余几经检讨,益信此书之宣播,正是昌明易学之玄机,而表彰因果之报应,是以有言。


中华民国七十一年(公元一九八二年)第二壬戌清明作于澄清湖上

Yang mansion fengshui - an inauspicious abode (murder) case study 發生兇殺案的住宅研究

已故名师 关风翔有一实例记录以下。 Below an old live yang mansion fengshui case extracted from the hand notes of mr kwan fung cheong (already passed away), a highly reputable fengshui master in hong kong since the 60th old days.

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發生兇殺案的住宅研究 (an inauspicious abode (murder) case study)
相宅之法,務須準古酌今,把宅形,宅運;宅主互相配合。亦即是空間;時間;人間的相互關係。空間三度,就是地理環境及其位置,結構及其形狀,方向及用事方位。時間一度,就是住宅的建築完成年代。人間一度,就是宅主的年命及入住的年代。
Yang mansion feng shui application nowadays, as per the proven accurate traditional methods till now the moden living age, would require to look into the mansion shape, mansion yun and mansion owner for matching and analysis. So, this means, the relationship among the space, time and human. The "space" refers to geographical and surrounding environment and the location, the building structure and shape, direction and the the location direction concerned. The "time" refers to the time period when the building contruction is complete for usage and living. The "human" refers to the mansion owner/occupant's birth year life (fall into which 5 elements, or 9 star or or 8 trigram) and the time period (yuan, yun, years) they are living there.
最近有人買得一個住宅單位,延齋主到看,準備裝修及入伙。地點在香港銅鑼灣琉璃街三號,名叫向南樓,係十樓A座。這是高層大廈式,分為三個單位,前面是A座和B座,後面是C座。看的是A座單位,在右邊,為三面單邊,後面是天井及樓梯。地理環境,屬於普通。坐子向午兼壬丙一分,宅門在艮位,主人房在坤位,廚房在乾位,客廳在巽位及震位,飯廳在兌位。
Recently a client bought a residental aparrment unit and appointed me (master kwan) for fengshui advice. The client is in progress of renovation and removal preparation. The apartment address is 香港銅鑼灣琉璃街三號,apartment name is 向南樓,the concerned apartment unit is on 10th floor at block A. The apartment is a high-rise type building , each storey consists of 3 units, two units Block A and B at the front and one unit Block C at their back behind. The one I am expected to look into is Block A whuch locates on the right side. The unit is structured with 3 sides unattached to neighbour units and one side connected to the common yard and staircase location sharing with the other two unit blocks on the same floor. Geographical surrounding environment is nothing special, the unit facing as per luopan is 坐子向午兼壬丙一分, main door position at GEN palace 艮位, master bedroom position at KUN palace坤位,kitchen position at QIAN palace 乾位,sitting hall position at XUN palace 巽位and ZHEN palace震位,dining hall position at DUI palace 兌位。
大廈興建完成是中元六運,齋主說,最初入住的人,是發財後遷出的,建議新宅主裝修,將廚房縮向右下角,使入門處較多迴旋餘地,如此則納氣較,財情有助。齋主又說,左邊B座,現在重門深鎖,似無人居住,但宅門在坎位,凶宅也。
The building belongs to 6th yun 中元六運. Master kwan said, the ex-owner of this apartment unit was having very prosperity luck in money since stayed in, had made a wealth prior to his removal out. Master kwan suggested his client, the new owner for renovation, to reduce the size of the kitchen contracting towards the right low corner, so as to give more space to the main door entrance area for improving the intake and storage of the qi good for wealth. Master kwan said also, the neighbour unit Block B is locked so seems idle and noone living in there , however the main door position at KAN palace 坎位,is considered as an inauspicious and bad luck abode 凶宅也.
A座新宅主謂,這一個單位去年舊曆十二月曾經發生凶殺案。齋主詢問他,B座單位原來居住者是否姓關?余氏謂不錯。
The new owner of block A unit said, last lunar year 12th month a murdering incident had happened in the block B unit.
齋主說,此人係齋主的同族兄弟,名叫楊枝,一九五四年與其兄登枝由越南回港,其父遺產甚豐,兄弟分家後,在香港及九龍購置不少物業收租。去年舊曆十二月某日下午四時,其八歲兒子放學回家,不得其門而入,於是往附近同學家中,撥電話黃竹坑外婆家詢問,外婆謂他的母親未有來,著其次女來接姨甥,帶姨甥到其姊的住宅拍門,久無應聲,心知有異,攜同姨甥落樓下管理處,請管理員往附近找開門鎖的工匠,管理員表示須找得警察到來,方能開門鎖。
Master kwan asked, was the unit owner with surname kwan? The reply was yes. Master kwan said, that unit owner came from the same tribe of him, name 楊枝. 1954 that person came with his brother from Vietnam to Hong Kong, both were inherited rich from their father, therefore owned many properties in Hong Kong. Last lunar year 12th month, one of the day at 4:00pm, his 8 years okd son back home from school but the door was locked and noone responded inside. So the young child went to his schoolmate home nearby to call up his grand mother for help. Her grand mother replied his his mother was not at her place so sent her 2nd daughter to pick up her nephew. This child brought his aunt to the unit knocking door for quite awhile, however still no response. His aunt began worrying so approached the apartment security guard to look for help if any locksmith nearby. The security guard eventually called up the police for assistance.
及至開門鎖後,赫然見有兩屍體,其一為女性,穿紅色睡衣褲,另一為男性,穿恤衫西褲,乃關楊枝夫婦二人,身被數刀,血流遍客廳中,客廳茶几上還有兩杯茶,顯然是相熟的人,到來探訪,不知如何,頓起殺機,致令關楊枝夫婦遭兇殺,但屋內物件沒有凌亂,並非劫匪所為,翌日各報章均有詳細報導,但迄今仍未破案,沉海底。
Finally the door was opened, two dead bodies were found inside, they were the parents of the child. Both were found being stabbed at several place of their bodies so blood was all over the sitting hall. The tea table was still.having two cups of tea, so suspected someone they knew was visiting them, and for unknown reason the visitor triggered the murdering. As inside the unit everything were found tidy and no lost so opted out the possibility of robbering. On subsequent days this murder case was reported in several newspaper in details. However, by now this murder case is still open for investigation.
齋主看過十樓A座用事方位之後,再測發生兇殺案之B座用事方位,因為B座在左邊,宅門在子位,主人房在巽位。雖然重門深鎖,但看過A座的用事方位,可以知道B座的宅內用事方位了,這是從建築結構揣測。
Master kwan based on his understanding on the layout of the 10th floor block A unit, to make an evaluation for the Block B unit. Since the block B unit locates at the left side on 10th floor, the main door position at luopan mountain "ZI" 子位,master bedroom at XUN巽位。
上面兩圖所示,A座雖未合天心正運,但宅門進氣,雙星到向,合七星打劫之法,震離乾三方為三六九,離方開朗,乾方為廚房,震方之氣雖不通,但原日居住的人,在震方客廳裝玻璃鏡,故能協吉。
Although by now (7th YUN) the Block A unit is no longer at the timely Yun, the main door at GEN palace is still taking the good qi, with the double stars in front雙星到向, matched with 7 stars robbing method 七星打劫, ZHEN LI QIAN palaces with yun stars 3,6,9, Li Side is no blocking, QIAN side is kitchen, ZHEN side is the sitting hall installed with mirror, all these would enable prosperity and good luck.
B座宅門在五黃大殺之位,主人房在二黑病符之位,廚房在「57九」之位,金火相戰。去年舊曆丙寅年災煞臨宅門,十二月五黃大煞又復到門,凶禍不免。為什麼夫婦二人同遭兇殺?因為宅門「75二」,乾與兌是後天夫婦,因為主婦是續娶的。且有兇手二人入宅的卦象。宅主係一九二六年丙寅歲出生,屬中元坤命,居坎宅,乃係西命人居東宅,且又三煞五黃交攻,致遭凶禍,惜哉!
As for the Block B unit, main door at the 5 yellow killing star location五黃大殺位, master bedroom at 2 black sickness star location 二黑病符位, kitchen at 「57九」位 where fire fights against metal 金火相戰。Last lunar year 丙寅年 "災煞"臨" "disiaster star arrived main door 宅門,in lunar 12th month the 5 yellow again came to the main door , so severe harmful and bad lucks would be unavoidable. Why the couple were the victims? Because the main door flyingstars were 「75二」,QIAN and DUI as per laterly heaven 8 trigrams are couple, 乾與兌是後天夫婦,due to the lady was his 2nd wife 因為主婦是續娶的。besides, there was gua sign showing 2 murderers entered into the resident unit. The owner was born in 1962丙寅 ,belongs to KUN qua life 中元坤命,live in a KAN mansion 坎宅,would be a West life person live in an East mansion 西命人居東宅,along with also the 3-killing 三煞 and 5-yellow 五黃 harmful qi attracking,into such dreadful consequence.